Interviewith grace Murray Hopper interviewers: Beth Luebert, Henny Tropp date of interview: 5 July 1972 place of interview: nm

Computer Oral History Collection, 1969-1973, 1977 

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Grace Murray Hopper Interview, July 5, 1972, Archives Center, National Museum of American History 

 

 

LUEBBERT: 

That would be fine. Just to have. 

HOPPER: 

I would have to zerox them. 

HOPPER: 

Let me have a piece of your pad (                          ?). I usually have a pack of cards with 

me and I forgot them today. 

 

LUEBBERT: 

I was interested in the role of computers in the military. I wrote a paper on it for a course 

at MIT last semester and was looking through the early developments both analogue and 

digital and filling out military applications, I found a lot more this summer and I could 

have written a better paper.  That's one of the reasons I liked your writing. 

TROPP: 

Well, is it a more interesting avenue of research… 

HOPPER: 

Well up until the time as far as I know, before I got there, remember we were pretty much 

confined to the Bureau of Ordnance. So about all we heard about were the analogue fire 

control computers. 

I did know that there was a certain amount of computing done at (                             ?) but 

I knew very little about that, the military computer. 

TROPP: 

Now the military was…(voice fades out). 

HOPPER: 

They were very much concerned. You see, guided missiles were beginning in '44. The 

work was already on at Franklin Institute on the (Bat?) and those things. So we heard 

about those. Of course that involved a tremendous amount of contradiction. 

LUEBBERT: 

For additional information, contact the Archives Center at 202.633.3270 or [e-mail]

 

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Computer Oral History Collection, 1969-1973, 1977 

19

 

Grace Murray Hopper Interview, July 5, 1972, Archives Center, National Museum of American History 

 

 

I was interested in the Franklin Institute. Going through, trying to figure out who was 

Aiken as a person? What he was like to work for? What were his ideas? The Franklin 

Institute wrote a paper on him when they gave him Harry Good Memorial? 

TROPP: 

No, the Harry Good is another one. No, the Franklin Institute has its own medal. 

LUEBBERT: 

Well, the Franklin Institute Medal, they wrote a paper for him. I've got a copy of that, and 

I was wondering what sources they would have consulted? 

HOPPER: 

They got most of it from me. 

LUEBBERT: 

They got most of it from you. 

HOPPER: 

You see, Captain, I can't think of his name, any how the guy that was in charge of the 

(Bat?) program, came from Franklin Institute and when the War was over went back to 

Franklin Institute and then was the Commanding Officer of my Navy Reserve Unit. 

So when they were going to give the medal to Aiken, I was in Philadelphia and belonged 

to the Franklin Institute and he was the Commanding Officer of my Ordnance Unit and 

he asked me about Aiken. 

TROPP: 

This is probably the same gentleman who is now listed as a retired rear admiral. 

HOPPER: 

I can't think of his name. 

TROPP: 

Is it (Farnie?) 

HOPPER: 

For additional information, contact the Archives Center at 202.633.3270 or [e-mail]

 

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Computer Oral History Collection, 1969-1973, 1977 

20

 

Grace Murray Hopper Interview, July 5, 1972, Archives Center, National Museum of American History 

 

 

No. No, he was a Captain. I can look it up though. I can probably find it. 

LUEBBERT: 

You've been talking about the war tactic for speed and getting things done quickly and on 

time. What do you see as Aiken's idea for the speed of his machines? Or was he just 

using what he could see at the time and he didn't think at all of the electronics? 

HOPPER: 

Things had to be built out of what we had. He was thinking electronics because he was 

going to move into it, you see, when he built Mark III. He was thinking of it. But he had 

to build things out of what worked at that time. He couldn't afford to fiddle around with 

circuits yet. 

It wasn't until (Rubinoff?) came from Canada with the beginning of the building of the 

Mark III that they began to work on circuits. 

TROPP: 

When did he start talking to you about the electronic possibilities? 

HOPPER: 

He didn't talk to us about it. He said we are going to build Mark III and then he started to 

find the crew to build it. There wasn't time to talk. And it wasn't until (Rubinoff?) 

appeared that we even knew (Rubinoff?) was coming. 

And (Rubinoff?) however was unique, he was the only engineer I ever knew, back there 

in the beginning, who said about building a computer, first we have a problem on one. 

(Rubinoff?) got me to teach him how to program Mark II, Mark I. He ran a problem on 

Mark I before he started working on Mark III. It was unique. 

TROPP: 

It sounds like the thing that… 

HOPPER: 

He's a guy you must go and talk to (                       ?), Morris (Rubinoff?). 

TROPP: 

That sounds like something Von Neumann …(voice fades out). 

For additional information, contact the Archives Center at 202.633.3270 or [e-mail]

 

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