Aa history Lovers 2004 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page

to be perfectly acceptable for reading in meetings by any other A.A. groups in

the world. That seemed to have been the key: if that pamphlet or little book

been sponsored by an A.A. group somewhere then it was perfectly O.K. for other

A.A. groups to use.

In early A.A. the New York office took this position too: something that is

written and printed by the members of one A.A. group is totally legitimate to

read in A.A. meetings anywhere else. Dr. Bob and Bill W. both put themselves

on record as supporting that principle. Jack H. in Scottsdale, Arizona, has a

copy of The Little Red Book which Dr. Bob had personally made notes on, making

suggestions to Ed Webster for changes or additions to be made in the next

edition. It is obvious that Dr. Bob gave his O.K. to the four Akron pamphlets

also. Bill W. wrote to Ed Webster in November 1950 and said "we are not

policemen" here at the New York headquarters, "AAs are free to read any book

they choose."

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Usually in early A.A. (though not necessarily, since each A.A. group is

completely autonomous and can read anything it wants to) books and pamphlets

which were not sponsored by a particular A.A. group were only read outside of

formal A.A. meetings. In early A.A. in South Bend, Indiana, for example,

little groups would gather in people's homes to read and talk about the latest

Golden Book, but they would not call these "A.A. meetings" in the formal

sense. They were just little private groups of A.A. members gathering on their

own. The Golden Books were printed and distributed by Ralph Pfau (Father John

Doe) on his own. They had marked on the title page that they were published by

the "SMT Guild," which meant the "Society of Matt Talbott," which in turn

meant Father Ralph himself and the three nuns who served as his secretaries

and helpers in the convent in Indianapolis where he lived as confessor to the

sisters. Ralph got along O.K. with the A.A.

groups in Indianapolis where he was based, but none of the Indianapolis groups

officially sponsored these Golden Books, and he basically had to do that on

his own.

Likewise, the books on the early Akron A.A. recommended reading list (Emmet

Fox's Sermon on the Mount, James Allen's As a Man Thinketh, Henry Drummond's

The Greatest Thing in the World, Ernest Ligon's Psychology of Christian

Personality, and so on) were not usually, to the best of my knowledge, read

from or used for providing meeting topics in formal A.A. meetings.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On the other hand, A.A. groups all around the country had books which were on

this Akron list for sale for A.A. members to purchase. Mel B. (sober 1950)

bought two books from this list in Detroit A.A. when he was first getting

sober. When I asked Brooklyn Bob here in South Bend whether there was any rule

in early A.A. about "only reading conference-approved literature," he snorted

and laughed and said, "We read anything we could get our hands on that might

get us sober!" Real early A.A. was like that, intensely pragmatic -- these

were not rule-bound uptight people who thought that you could get people sober

by repeating mechanical formula phrases and preventing the members from ever

reading or hearing anything that was not approved by the tiny circle of people

who led the organization -- all the really good old-timers whom I have

interviewed have had that same kind of marvelously free and flexible spirit as

Brooklyn Bob had, they're just wonderful

people.

So if A.A. people who had some sobriety under their belts in various parts of

the country said, "Yeah, that book by Emmet Fox, The Sermon on the Mount, sure

helped me and some of our other members when we first came in -- it doesn't

work for everybody, you know, but for some of us it really opened our eyes as

to what we were supposed to be doing when we were working the steps" -- then

A.A. people in other parts of the country would read it and see if it helped

them. And if it helped enough people there, then it would be made available

for sale at their A.A. group or their intergroup office, and newcomers would

be encouraged to read it if it seemed appropriate to that particular person's

central problems.

And contrariwise, I remember when one of John Bradshaw's later books was

literally driving some susceptible people over the edge into full-fledged

psychosis, where their attempts to use his methods to come into contact with

their "Inner Child" did so much psychological damage that they had to be

institutionalized for several years afterwards. I'm not kidding, they were

genuinely and literally driven insane by the traumatic stuff that started

coming out of their subconscious minds. It was only a few people who were

driven literally insane in this way, but the word nevertheless spread through

responsible A.A. circles in my part of northern Indiana: Do NOT give that book

to newcomers, or anybody else, it's too dangerous. Do NOT sell that book at

the intergroup offices. WARN people who start talking about reading that book

about how dangerous it is. We can't play games like that with people's lives.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

But the idea which sprang up in the late 1980's and early 1990's, that somehow

or other it wasn't "proper" for an A.A. group or intergroup to sell helpful

books that weren't published by Alcoholics Anonymous World Services in New

York is another thing that is threatening to cut A.A. off from its historical

roots. The New York office never ever had the money to publish all the useful

books that could help a recovering alcoholic, and still doesn't today. The

traditions forbid A.A. itself from having the kind of wealthy publishing

houses that some of the larger religious denominations have (Abingdon Press,

Fortress Press, Augsburg Press, Westminster Press, Loyola University Press,

Ave Maria Press, and so on, for the Methodists, Lutherans, Roman Catholics,

and the other large church organizations).

Therefore we MUST to a certain extent rely on individuals to publish some of

the literature which A.A. needs in order to be successful. The important thing

is to make it clear at all times that several people who get together to

publish some books on A.A. cannot claim any official A.A. connection in

anything that shows up in public, even if all of them are A.A. members.

Likewise, an A.A. group itself cannot get involved in the enormous monetary

expense of publishing a full sized book -- this can sometimes require

thousands of dollars for the initial investment.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Also, just for myself, I would prefer that A.A. books of this sort be

published on a totally nonprofit basis if at all possible, just as Richmond

Walker did when he was printing and distributing his Twenty-Four Hour book. I

have a rule for myself that I will not be involved in publication ventures

involving any kind of program-related material, unless the group publishing it

is a genuine nonprofit organization which exists only to help alcoholics.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

At any rate, Linda, I hope that some of these materials may give you some

useful ideas. Having a set of Beginners' Meetings for newcomers is an old A.A.

tradition that goes back to the early 1940's in many parts of the United

States and Canada.

Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana)

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++++Message 1915. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: THE A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY

OF DISTRIBUTION

From: Rob Childs . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/14/2004 8:21:00 PM

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10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;">Do you know how to get an ascii version

of the big book? Is that the computer disk or CD version? If so, how does one

order a copy?

10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy;">

-----Original Message-----

*From:* JOHN REID

[mailto:[e-mail]]

*Sent:* Wednesday, July 14, 2004

3:49 AM

*To:*

[e-mail]

*Subject:* [AAHistoryLovers] THE

A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY OF DISTRIBUTION

12.0pt;">

Below are the

literature piece that are updated annually.

Service Material from the General Service

Office

THE A.A. MESSAGE IN PRINT-SUMMARY OF

DISTRIBUTION

First Printing through December 31, 2003

*Alcoholics

Anonymous (Big Book)*

English (First printing - 1939)

Hardcover (B-1) 15,845,956

Softcover (B-30) 6,713,109

Large Print (B-16) 241,712

Pocket/abridged (B-35) 1,163,732

Total: 23,964,509

Spanish (First Printing - 1962)

Hardcover (SB-1) 53,561

Softcover (SB-30) 495,032

Pocket/abridged (SB-35) 68,024

Total: 616,617

*Twelve

Steps and Twelve Traditions**

*

English (First Printing - 1952)

Hardcover (B-2) 7,842,858

Pocket Size (B-17) 412,778

Softcover (B-15) 2,254,309

Large Print (B-14) 120,208

Gift Edition (B-4) 1,386,176

Total: 12,016,329

Spanish (First Printing - 1985)

Softcover (SB-15) 357,325

Pocket Size (SB-17) 37,440

Total: 394,765

Other Formats

Audio Cassettes: Big Book (MB-1) 79,659

Big Book (MB-1A) 490

Twelve & Twelve (MB-2) 38,937

Big Book CD ROM (M-70) 517

Big Book Audio CD (M-81) 1,235

Spanish Big Book (SMB-1) 6,839

Spanish Twelve & Twelve (SMB-2) 11,320

Braille: Big Book (M-34) 2,766

Twelve & Twelve (M-35) 1,717

ASL Video: Big Book (VS-1) 1,910

Computer Disk: Big Book (M-53) 7,234

12.0pt;">

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++++Message 1916. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: AA on the Internet

From: soul . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 6:43:00 AM

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The Online Service Conference has a nice page on AA History on the

Internet Here is the link http://www.aa-

onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the%

20Internet .

soul

--- In [e-mail], "Gary Becktell"

wrote:

> Does anyone have any info on the early days of AA on the

Internet, and

> the Bulletin Boards that preceded the Internet? Thank you.

> G

> gk@k...

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++++Message 1917. . . . . . . . . . . . 4th Edition Big Book

From: chillydog012001 . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/13/2004 5:34:00 PM

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I am interested in the years and General Service Conference votes

that took place in order to publish the 4th Edition of the Big Book.

How many votes took place and what was the general consensus at the

group level.

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++++Message 1918. . . . . . . . . . . . principles before personalities...

From: Stanley . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 2:04:00 PM

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I'm new to this mailing list; but certainly not new to A.A. (16 years

sobriety) and I have a question that I hope someone familiar to A.A. history

could help me with. I've read most of the books sanctioned by A.A.; but

can't remember how the last part of the 12th Tradition came into being. The

"...principles before personalities" part.

I am really excited about this mailing list!

Stan

**********************************************************************

Stanley Koehler In the heart of the Ozarks

[e-mail] Springfield, MO

**********************************************************************

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++++Message 1919. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Re: AA on the Internet

From: Mark Warner . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/15/2004 12:29:00 PM

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soul wrote:

> The Online Service Conference has a nice page on AA History on the

> Internet Here is the link http://www.aa-

> onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the%

> 20Internet .

http://www.aa-onlineserviceconference.org/history_online_aa.htm#AA%20on%20the%

20\

Internet [85]

http://tinyurl.com/3qk69

--

Mark Warner

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++++Message 1920. . . . . . . . . . . . Report from the Moderator

From: [e-mail] . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 2:37:00 AM

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Friends,

A few items:

1. As of tomorrow, July 17, I will be out of town for a few days and the AA

history lovers will be inactive. I will be at Shreveport, LA for a talk to the

Louisiana Association of Substance Abuse Counselors and Trainers, Inc. If any

members of the list will be present I would be delighted to meet you.

2. I have been doing a post every month of significant dates in AA history. I

have been unwell for the last several week and have not had the energy to

finish the July list. Is anyone willing to take this over for me? As my

sources I use the 2004 Sobriety Calendar PLUS this website:

Sobriety Anniversaries [86]

BTW, July 21, 1980, Marry Mann suffered her fatal stroke. She died the next

day. I sorely miss her.

3. I may also have to turn the AA history list over to someone else in the

near future -- at least temporarily. At least temporarily. I warn that it is

very time consuming so a single, retired person might be the ideal.

4. As of today there are 901 members of the list. Each day it seems to advance

by one or two members, then suddenly ten members will disappear. The mysteries

of the Internet. I think it has something to do with "bouncing," whatever the

devil that means. If anyone can explain it, this ol' gal would be

appreciative.

I hope you are all having a good summer and that I will meet some of you in

Louisiana over the next few days.

Fondly,

Nancy Olson

Moderator

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++++Message 1921. . . . . . . . . . . . Principles before personalities

From: marathonmanric . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 8:57:00 AM

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Hello AAHistory Lovers,

My understanding of that phrase in the 12th tradition (...ever

reminding us to place principles before personalities.) has always

been the realization that there are no expert personalities or

occupations in AA. No Doctors or clergy which many have a "hand up"

on the recovery process.

If you are a member of Alcoholics Anonymous and, in turn, have a

desire to stop and stay stopped drinking, you are also just another

recovering alcoholic, and we all learn from each other. We learn the

same principles and our recovery is not based on any type of

personality.

Ric the GratefulCamel in Miami

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++++Message 1922. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: principles before personalities...

From: Arthur Sheehan . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 10:58:00 AM

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Hi Stanley and welcome on board. What follows is a bit of long answer to your

short question. A useful place to get a sense of the context of the Traditions

is their long form. Tradition 12's long form is:

And finally, we of Alcoholics Anonymous believe that the principle of

Anonymity has an immense spiritual significance. It reminds us that we are to

place principles before personalities; that we are actually to practice a

genuine humility. This to the end that our great blessings may never spoil us;

that we shall forever live in thankful contemplation of Him who presides over

us all.

Below is a timeline of some milestones in the evolution of the Traditions.

SOURCE REFERENCES:

AACOA - AA Comes of Age, AAWS

GTBT - Grateful to Have Been There by Nell Wing (soft cover)

LOH - The Language of the Heart, AA Grapevine Inc

PIO - Pass It On, AAWS

SM - AA Service Manual and Twelve Concepts for World Service, AAWS

1942

Correspondence from groups gave early signals of a need to develop guidelines

to help with group problems that occurred repeatedly. The basic ideas for the

Twelve Traditions emerged from this correspondence and the principles defined

in the Foreword to the first Ed. of the Big Book. (AACOA 187, 192-193, 198,

204, PIO 305-306, LOH 154)

1945

April, Earl Treat, founder of AA in Chicago (Big Book Story: He Sold Himself

Short) suggested to Bill W that he codify the Traditions and write essays on

them in the Grapevine. (AACOA 22, 203, GTBT 54-55, 77, SM S8, PIO 306, LOH

20-24)

August, the Grapevine carried Bill W's first article (Modesty One Plank for

Good Public Relations) and set the groundwork for Bill's 5-year campaign for

the Traditions. The July Grapevine edition had an article by member CHK of

Lansing, MI about the Washingtonians. Bill used this article to begin his

essay commentaries.

1946

April, the Grapevine carried Bill W's article Twelve Suggested Points for AA

Tradition. They would later be called the long form of the Twelve Traditions.

(AACOA viii, 96, 203, LOH 20, 154)

1949

As plans for the first Int'l Convention were under way, Earl T suggested to

Bill W that the Twelve Suggested Points for AA Tradition would benefit from

revision and shortening. (AACOA 213 says it occurred in 1947) Bill, with

Earl's help, set out to develop the short form of the Twelve Traditions.

(AACOA 213, GTBT 55, 77, PIO 334)

November, the short form of the Twelve Traditions was first printed in the AA

Grapevine. The entire issue was dedicated to the Traditions in preparation for

the forthcoming Cleveland Convention. Two wording changes were subsequently

made to the initial version: "primary spiritual aim" was changed to "primary

purpose" in Tradition Six, and "principles above personalities" was changed to

"principles before personalities" in Tradition Twelve. (LOH 96 and copy of Nov

1949 Grapevine)

1950

Jul 28-30, AA's 15th anniversary and first International Convention at

Cleveland, OH. An estimated 3,000 attendees adopted the Twelve Traditions

unanimously. (AACOA 43, LOH 121, PIO 338)

----- Original Message -----

From: Stanley

To: A.A. History

Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2004 2:04 PM

Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] principles before personalities...

I'm new to this mailing list; but certainly not new to A.A. (16 years

sobriety) and I have a question that I hope someone familiar to A.A. history

could help me with. I've read most of the books sanctioned by A.A.; but

can't remember how the last part of the 12th Tradition came into being. The

"...principles before personalities" part.

I am really excited about this mailing list!

Stan

**********************************************************************

Stanley Koehler In the heart of the Ozarks

[e-mail] Springfield, MO

**********************************************************************

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++++Message 1923. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Principles before personalities

From: Danny S . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/16/2004 2:39:00 PM

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In Tradition 12, is about "anonymity". In the long form, "principal

before personalities" is in reference back to the word "anonymity".

It describes a reminder which anonymity gives us. The other reminder

born out of anonymity is humility.

The subject of "nonprofessional" versus "professional" is addressed

in Tradition 8, not 12.

Hope this is helpful

Peace,

Danny S

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++++Message 1924. . . . . . . . . . . . Dr. Bob''s Tattoos

From: Roger Dowdy . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/19/2004 12:47:00 PM

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I'm looking for additional information regarding Dr. Bob's tattoos (i.e.

location, where he got them, etc.). Here's all I've been able to find thus

far (thanks to Silkworth.net):

A tattoo he wore the rest of his life was probably from those days at

Dartmouth: a dragon and a compass tattoo. The dragon wound around his left

arm from the shoulder to the wrist. It was blue with red fire. His son

thinks "he had to have been drunk to have it put there, and you didn't do

something that complicated in a day. When I asked him how he got it, he

said, 'Boy, that was a dandy!' And it must have been, too."

Many thanks, in advance!

-Roger

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++++Message 1925. . . . . . . . . . . . The Upper Room and its influence on

early A.A.

From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/20/2004 12:28:00 PM

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After some years of searching, I have just found some copies of The Upper Room

from 1938 and 1939. This was the meditational book which most A.A. people used

to read every morning during the early period (1935-1948). Reading through

them proved to be even more insightful than I had dreamed. You can get a real

feel for the simple but incredibly deep Christian piety of Anne Smith, and you

find meditation after meditation where it almost seems as through you are

sitting in a very good modern A.A. meeting.

I have made some excerpts of typical readings which illustrate the kind of

influence which The Upper Room had on early A.A. In order to format it in a

way that will be readable, I have had to organize it in a way that cannot be

set up in an e-mail. So I apologize for having to do it this way, but you will

be able to read these passages by clicking here:

http://hindsfoot.org/UpRm1.html (it is also listed if you click on "A.A.

Historical Materials" over on the left hand side in the general Hindsfoot