Aa history Lovers 2009 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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> the disease of alcoholism and how it had made my life unmanageable. I > thought that people, places, and things were the real problems. It > took > AA members with good long-term sobriety to help me get the focus > back on > me. When newcomers come in talking about outside issues, it's my > responsibility to keep things on track in the same loving and careful > way that others used to walk me through my early sobriety. > > ---------------------- > Grapevine, January 1997 > from an article titled "A Powerful Assignment" by Ben N., White > Plains, > New York > > Nervous? Yes, I was. As the phone was ringing, I rehearsed what I was > going to say. But I was already quite proud of what I knew that I knew > about the First Step. Then Vince answered. Everything got jumbled up > but > he put me at ease and I began to explain the First Step to him. I told > him about the unmanageability — that my life had become very small; > everything reduced to shoebox size. There wasn't very much in my life > and no room for people. Then I launched into a dissertation on > powerlessness. I really couldn't wait to get to this. I mentioned > how we > were powerless over people, places, and things. On and on I went, > giving > various examples — this was a full-blown, definitely AA-grounded, > exposition. I waited for Vince to tell me how wonderfully I'd mastered > the Step. I was ready to swell with pride. Then, in a soft voice he > said: "It says 'powerless over alcohol.' " > > ------------------------------ > AA Grapevine, April 1997 > from an article titled "From Two-Stepping to Twelve-Stepping" by John > M., Santa Barbara, California > > I learned from Al-Anon and private therapy that I'm powerless not only > over alcohol, but also people, places, and things. > > ------------------------------ > Grapevine, July 1997 > from an article titled "EVERYTHING TO GAIN AND NOTHING TO LOSE" by > Niurka R., Houston, Texas > > I've been in and out of several juvenile and adult penal > institutions. I > always made resolutions to change and never return. At the age of > eighteen attempted to attend AA meetings in prison to change my life > around and combat my alcoholism, but there was no sincerity in my > heart. > was only doing it for my mother and to please other people; it wasn't > for myself. When I was released I went back to the old people, places, > and things that caused me to pay so much. I still viewed the drinking > life as being fun. I was reincarcerated again at the age of twenty. > I've
> been here now for sixteen months. This time I've had an opportunity to > sit and take a personal inventory of my life. I came to the conclusion > that I want to change and need to change if I am to live. I was never > more serious about anything in my life. I've started attending AA > meetings and substance abuse meetings, and reading my Big Book every > day.
> > ------------------------------ > AA Grapevine, September 1997 > from an article titled "Reintroduced To Myself" by Jody B., New Bern, > North Carolina > > The seed of AA was there, and on mornings when I hurt physically and > didn't remember the night before, I'd wonder: should I give AA a fair > shot? For six months I'd pull a few days together, then celebrate > with a > drink. I really felt as though I was going crazy. I was afraid to > believe in a higher power and I continued downhill, never remembering > the night before, still going to AA while comparing my way out. I was > constitutionally incapable of being honest. The law brought me to my > bottom and I decided to give AA an honest try. At twenty-three months > sober, I had changed people, places, and things, gotten a sponsor, and > worked Steps One through Five. I was doing the things suggested but I > still felt alone and didn't know myself. > > ------------------------------ > > > > Jon Markle wrote: > > I don't want to debate this here. (I have, obviously a different > experience > > I just want to find out where or how it got into the rooms of AA. > > It's not in the Big Book. I don't think it's in any of AA's other > literature or textbooks, either, but I can't say that with complete > authority -- yet. > > Thanks. > > Hugs for the trudge > Jon (Raleigh) > 9/9/82
> > > > From: Jon Markle > Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] "People places things" > To: "AAHistoryLovers" > Date: Sunday, June 21, 2009, 9:45 PM > > Where does the concept of powerlessness over "people, places and > things" come from? > > Hugs for the trudge. > > Jon (Raleigh) > 9/9/82 > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > >
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5825. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Re: History of sponsorship From: Baileygc23@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 4:35:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII In a message dated 6/24/2009 1:51:54 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, serenitylodge@mac.com writes: It is a part of the AA program that is not only "suggested" but essentially, a "must" if we want the full benefits of real recovery. Only those who are isolationists think otherwise. IMO. Bill W said there was no dogma. Is there dogma now? We have to be careful we do not end up a cult. The only way not to be a cult is not to do cultist things. **************Check all of your email inboxes from anywhere on the web. Try the new Email Toolbar now! (http://toolbar.aol.com/mail/download.html?ncid=txtlnkusdown00000027)
things"
From: johnlawlee@yahoo.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 7:56:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII The topic is "powerless over people, places and things", wnich cliche is absent
from the basic literature of AA, NA and Al-Anon. The topic is not "people, places and things." According to the Unofficial Big Book Search Engine, the word "people" is found on 78 pages of the basic text. "People" isn't the topic
either. You won't find the cliche "powerless over people places things" in the
basic literature of AA. You won't find it in the basic literature of NA or Al-Anon either. You won't locate the recommendation "avoid people places and things" in the basic literature of those three fellowships, although that nugget
is heard frequently in rehabs, AA meetings and NA meeetings. You'll hear the chanting of "keep coming back" at virtually every AA meeting, but that's not in the basic text of AA either. I don't believe you'll find it in the Bigger Book either [the one with the black cover and ribbon]. Christ never said, "Keep coming back." He said, "Heal the sick...Freely have you received, freely give." In AA we carry the message to those who still suffer. Pass it on. John Lee
Pittsburgh --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Robert Stonebraker From: Robert Stonebraker Subject: RE: [AAHistoryLovers] Re: "People places things" To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Date: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 5:50 PM The inquiry comes from the previous message concerning the validity of page Dr. Paul's quote from page 417. The answer: The stories in the second section of the book are not considered as the clear cut directions. Please read page 29: "Further on clear cut directions are given showing how we recovered. These are followed by forty-two personal experiences. " The personal experiences are not the clear cut directions. Bob S. www.4dgroups. org ============ ========= ========= ========= ========= ========= ======== From: AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of bridgetsbuddy Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 9:39 AM To: AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Re: "People places things"
place, thing, or situation -- some fact of my life -- unacceptable to me, and I can find no serenity until I accept that person, place, thing, or situation as being exactly the way it is supposed to be at this moment." ("Acceptance was the Answer," BB, 4th Ed., p.417) No?
...>
>
> Where does the concept of powerlessness over "people, places and > > Hugs for the trudge. > > Jon (Raleigh) > 9/9/82 > > "The violets in the mountains have broken the rocks." (Tennessee > Williams) > > "Hope is the feeling we have that the feeling we have is not > permanent." (M.McLaughlin) > > "You know, I occasionally watch those preachers on the Christian TV > stations. I always think to myself: How can I believe your theology > when I can't believe your hair?" (Patricia Clarkson) > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5827. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: History of sponsorship From: elg3_79 . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 9:15:00 AM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII --- Jon Markle > > It [sponsorship] is a part of the AA program that is not only "suggested" but > essentially, a "must" if we want the full benefits of real recovery. > Only those who are isolationists think otherwise. IMO. > >> Just to play devil's advocate, Chuck Chamberlain in _A New Pair Of Glasses_ said "I've never had a sponsor in this program. Never." He elaborated (I can't hold on to a copy of that book and so don't have one to quote from exactly) that when he got to AA he didn't feel like he deserved that much attention from anyone, and when he began to get better, he used everyone to help him learn what
to do and avoid doing. Clancy Imislund relates that when he made an appointment with Chuck to ask for sponsorship, Chuck made small talk with him until the question was popped and then said "My, I thought you were coming here to offer to sponsor _me_." Y'all's in service Ted G.
++++Message 5828. . . . . . . . . . . . Pg 163 who is the AA member, the 2 psychiatrists, and the hospitals? From: rickcard47 . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 11:21:00 AM
member
was, and what the test was that "that the doctor agreed to a test among his patients". Also it mentions 2 psychiatrists, any ideas? And what was the hospital and clinic?
2 psychiatrists, and the hospitals? From: Lee Carroll . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 12:40:00 PM
near Orangeburg NY. My interpretation of ".the doctor agreed to a test among his patients." is not that he had a test, per se, but rather, to test this program, which our friend (Hank) had described.
Regulations governing tax practice, you are hereby advised that, if any advice concerning one or more U.S. Federal tax issues is contained in this communication (including any attachments), such advice is not intended or written to be used, and cannot be used, for the purpose of (i) avoiding penalties under the Internal Revenue Code or (ii) promoting, marketing or recommending to another party any transaction or matter addressed herein.
[mailto:AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of rickcard47 Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 8:21 AM To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Pg 163 who is the AA member, the 2 psychiatrists, and the hospitals? I am asuming that the large community is NY, but was wondering who the AA member was, and what the test was that "that the doctor agreed to a test among his patients". Also it mentions 2 psychiatrists, any ideas? And what was the hospital and clinic? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5830. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: Pg 163 who is the AA member, the 2 psychiatrists, and the hospitals? From: Bill Lash . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/25/2009 9:04:00 AM
ences.pdf Just Love, Barefoot Bill -----Original Message----- From: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com [mailto:AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of rickcard47 Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 11:21 AM To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Pg 163 who is the AA member, the 2 psychiatrists, and the hospitals?
member was, and what the test was that "that the doctor agreed to a test among his patients". Also it mentions 2 psychiatrists, any ideas? And what was the hospital and clinic? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5831. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: RE: "Powerless over people places things" From: James Flynn . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/24/2009 12:36:00 PM
expressions. Some of these expressions can be found in the AA literature and others can't.
Regardless of that fact, these saying and slogans are as much a part of authentic AA History as the coffee pot. AA is as AA does, and AA does use sayings and slogans. It always has and I believe that it always will.
Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] RE: "Powerless over people places things" To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 4:56 AM The topic is "powerless over people, places and things", wnich cliche is absent
from the basic literature of AA, NA and Al-Anon. The topic is not "people, places and things." According to the Unofficial Big Book Search Engine, the word "people" is found on 78 pages of the basic text. "People" isn't the topic
either. You won't find the cliche "powerless over people places things" in the
basic literature of AA. You won't find it in the basic literature of NA or Al-Anon either. You won't locate the recommendation "avoid people places and things" in the basic literature of those three fellowships, although that nugget
is heard frequently in rehabs, AA meetings and NA meeetings. You'll hear the chanting of "keep coming back" at virtually every AA meeting, but that's not in the basic text of AA either. I don't believe you'll find it in the Bigger Book either [the one with the black cover and ribbon]. Christ never said, "Keep coming back." He said, "Heal the sick...Freely have you received, freely give." In AA we carry the message to those who still suffer. Pass it on. John Lee
Pittsburgh --- On Tue, 6/23/09, Robert Stonebraker wrote:
Subject: RE: [AAHistoryLovers] Re: "People places things" To: AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com Date: Tuesday, June 23, 2009, 5:50 PM
Dr. Paul's quote from page 417. The answer: The stories in the second section of the book are not considered as the clear cut directions. Please read page 29: "Further on clear cut directions are given showing how we recovered. These are followed by forty-two personal experiences. " The personal experiences are not the clear cut directions. Bob S. www.4dgroups. org ============ ========= ========= ========= ========= ========= ======== From: AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:AAHistoryLo vers@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of bridgetsbuddy Sent: Tuesday, June 23, 2009 9:39 AM To: AAHistoryLovers@ yahoogroups. com Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] Re: "People places things"
place, thing, or situation -- some fact of my life -- unacceptable to me, and I can find no serenity until I accept that person, place, thing, or situation as being exactly the way it is supposed to be at this moment." ("Acceptance was the Answer," BB, 4th Ed., p.417) No?
...>
>
> Where does the concept of powerlessness over "people, places and > > Hugs for the trudge. > > Jon (Raleigh) > 9/9/82 > > "The violets in the mountains have broken the rocks." (Tennessee > Williams) > > "Hope is the feeling we have that the feeling we have is not > permanent." (M.McLaughlin) > > "You know, I occasionally watch those preachers on the Christian TV > stations. I always think to myself: How can I believe your theology > when I can't believe your hair?" (Patricia Clarkson) > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5832. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: RE: "Powerless over people places things" From: jenny andrews . . . . . . . . . . . . 6/26/2009 3:46:00 AM
establishing "AA" hospitals - about the only one to survive was the decision to publish the Big Book. Early members were aware that the message could be diluted, distorted and misrepresented when passed on orally. The slogans which
adorn the walls at so many AA meetings are not Conference-approved; though three
of them appear at the end of chapter nine in the Big Book, viz: First Things First; Live and Let Live; Easy Does It. One slogan - There but for the grace of God - is contentious, suggesting as it does that some alcoholics are chosen for salvation and others condemned. Likewise, the Serenity Prayer is not Conference-approved, though undoubtedly an established part of our oral tradition. So, unless tested by the Fellowship's group conscience as expressed at Conference, expressions heard at meetings, like e.g. Keep it simple stupid, should be taken with a pinch of salt. Some are more helpful than others; some are contrary to our tradition, e.g. "It (addiction) is all the same illness."
From: jdf10487@yahoo.com Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 09:36:02 -0700 Subject: Re: [AAHistoryLovers] RE: "Powerless over people places things" AA has a rich oral tradition which includes many sayings, slogans and common expressions. Some of these expressions can be found in the AA literature and others can't.
Regardless of that fact, these saying and slogans are as much a part of authentic AA History as the coffee pot. AA is as AA does, and AA does use sayings and slogans. It always has and I believe that it always will.
Subject: [AAHistoryLovers] RE: "Powerless over people places things" To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Date: Wednesday, June 24, 2009, 4:56 AM The topic is "powerless over people, places and things", wnich cliche is absent
from the basic literature of AA, NA and Al-Anon. The topic is not "people, places and things." According to the Unofficial Big Book Search Engine, the Yüklə 11,49 Mb. Dostları ilə paylaş:
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