Microsoft Word Elisabeth Kubler-Ross On Death And Dying doc

DOCTOR: What are you doing right now, here? 
PATIENT: What I'm doing right now is exchanging views which 
 might help. 
DOCTOR: Which is a valuable activity. It may be helpful to you 
 but it's certainly helpful to us. 
CHAPLAIN: A valuable activity in his sense, not his wife's. 
DOCTOR: Yes, (laughter) that's why I wanted to clarify it. What 
 you are really saying is that life is worthwhile living as long as 
 you can be of some value and do something worthwhile. 
PATIENT: But you know, it is also a nice thing to have somebody 
 else appreciate it. If you love them. 
DOCTOR: Do you really believe that nobody else appreciates you? 
PATIENT: I don't believe my wife does. 
CHAPLAIN: That's what I thought he was referring to, 
DOCTOR: Yes, what about your children? 
PATIENT: I think they do. But the wife is the big thing you know, 
 a man's wife. Especially if he admires her quite a bit, you 
 know. And she's so, you might say, lovable. Because she's so 
 full of sparkling energy and all that sort of thing. b 
CHAPLAIN: Has this been consistent with your marriage? Or has 
 this been more noticeable after your periods of grief? And loss? 
PATIENT: No different. Actually it's been better after the griefs 
 and loss. Well, right now, for instance, she has been very nice 
 to me for a while. Since I've been in the hospital, but ah, it's 
 always been that way. When I was sick or something like that, 
 why, she would act real nice to me for a while. But then she 
 couldn't get rid of this fact that here was a loafer who didn't 
 make any money. 
CHAPLAIN: Well, how do you account for the things that have 
 happened in your life? You mentioned going to church. How 
 do you account for the things that happened to you? In terms 
 
of your attitude toward life, what some people would call your faith in life. Does God play a part of 
this? 
 
PATIENT: Oh yes. Well, in the first place, as a Christian, Christ acts as an intermediator. It's very 
simple. When I keep the vision in view things work out pretty well. And I get relief from my- I get 
solutions to problems which concern people. 
 
CHAPLAIN: The very thing he's been talking about between his wife and himself is a need for a 
mediator, and you mentioned Christ as a mediator in your other problems. Have you thought of this 
in terms of your wife and your relationship? 
 
PATIENT: I have, but unfortunately or not, my wife is such a dynamic person. 
 
CHAPLAIN: What I hear you saying is your wife is so dynamic and active that there is no room for 
an active God in her life. There would be no room for a mediator. 

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PATIENT: Well, that's what it amounts to in her case. 
 
DOCTOR: Do you think she would be willing to talk to one of us? 
 
PATIENT: I certainly would, yes. 
 
DOCTOR: If you would ask her? Would that be okay with you? 
 
PATIENT: My wife would never think of going to a psychiatrist, especially with me. 
 
DOCTOR: Um hm. What's so scary about a psychiatrist? 
 
PATIENT: The very things we have been talking about. I think she sort of covers them up. 
 
DOCTOR: Well, let's see how that interview goes. It might be helpful. And if it's okay with you we 
will drop in once in a while. Okay? 
 
PATIENT: You are going to drop in, you say? 
 
DOCTOR: And visit you. 
 
PATIENT: At my bed? 
 
DOCTOR AND CHAPLAIN: Yes. 
 
PATIENT: I'll be leaving Saturday. 
 
DOCTOR: I see. So we don't have much time. 
 
CHAPLAIN: Well, if you are coming back to the clinics anytime, you might be coming back to see 
the doctor? 
 
PATIENT: I doubt it but might be. It's a long, long trip. 
 
CHAPLAIN: Oh, I see. 
 
DOCTOR: Well, if this is our last meeting, maybe you have some questions that you would like to 
ask. 
 
(P92) 
 
PATIENT: Well, I think that one of the biggest advantages of what this interview is that lots of 
questions have been brought out that I wouldn't have thought of. 
 
DOCTOR: It has helped us too. 
 

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PATIENT: I think that Dr. R. has made some very good suggestions and you have made good ones 
too. But I do know one thing, unless I make radical improvement, why, I will not be cured 
physically. 
 
DOCTOR: Is this scary? 
 
PATIENT: Scary? 
 
DOCTOR: I don't sense any fear in you. 
 
PATIENT: No, it wouldn't scare me, for two reasons. One, I have fairly well grounded religion 
which has been grounded in the fact that I have passed it on to other people. 
 
DOCTOR: So you can say of yourself that you are a man who does not fear death and who accepts 
it when it comes, just like that. 
 
PATIENT: Yes, I don't fear death but I do more or less fear the opportunity to continue my former 
activities. Because, you see, I didn't really like engineering as well as working with people. 
 
CHAPLAIN: This is where your interest in communications came in. 
 
PATIENT: Part of it, yes. 
 
CHAPLAIN: What strikes me is not the absence of fear but also the concern, sense of regret in 
terms of your relationship with your wife. 
 
PATIENT: I have regretted that all my life, that I couldn't communicate with her. You might say 
really, if you wanted to go down under the mat, in my study of communication was, I don't really 
know, but it probably might have been ninety percent trying to get together with my wife. 
 
DOCTOR: Trying to communicate with her, no? You never got any professional help for that? You 
know, I have a feeling that this could be helped, it still can be helped. 
 
CHAPLAIN: That's why tomorrow's meeting is so important. 
 
DOCTOR: Yes, yes . . . So I don't feel really helpless, this is not irrepairable, you know. You still 
have the time to do that. 
 
PATIENT: Well, I would say that as long as I am actually alive there is hope for life. 
 
DOCTOR: That's right. 
 
PATIENT: But life isn't the whole thing in the world. The quality of life, why you live it. 
 
CHAPLAIN: Well, I appreciate having had the chance to visit with you. I'd like to drop in on you 
this evening before I go home tonight. 
 

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