Aa history Lovers 2010 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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favorable publicity has brought to AA one half of its present membership. But
just suppose that these great channels of communication had been left wide open
to the winds of chance; or, worse still, had never been developed by us at all
... To maintain these life-giving arteries of world communication in full flow,
and in good repair, will always be a top priority task for each new generation of our Society. This will require of us a greatly increased understanding of the
immense need to be met, and a sustained devotion of the highest order..." Laurie A. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6738. . . . . . . . . . . . 1962 Reorganization Plan From: Cheryl F . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/19/2010 3:31:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Anyone out there have a copy of Bill W.'s 1962 Reorganization Plan proposal? Thanks in Advance, Cheryl IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6739. . . . . . . . . . . . Death of Pete Lowery From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/19/2010 3:50:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII From Tom Hickcox Pete Lowery passed away Tuesday, July 13th, obituary at: http://www.webfh.com/fh/obituaries/obituary.cfm?o_id=317636&fh_id=10416&ck=1 Pete was known to many members of the AAHistoryLovers as a specialist in Big Books and A.A. pamphlets. He also knew a lot about the Little Red Book and the 24 Hr book. He lived in Palmer, Texas, and claimed Searcy as a sponsor. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6740. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Death of Pete Lowery From: Rae Turnbull . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/19/2010 4:49:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Pete would bring his AA Archives to Corpus Christi for the Coastal Bend Jamboree and always donated AA books for our silent auction.
and will be greatly missed. Rae T Corpus Christi, Texas IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6741. . . . . . . . . . . . In Tune with the Infinite From: jax760 . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/25/2010 5:32:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I have just completed this book by Ralph Waldo Trine (originally published in 1897), admittedly I am so far behind on my reading. I did want to share the many similarities of this "New Thought" work with our big book. One of the contributors to this site Jim B. many years ago developed a pamphlet that details the influences on the big book with many influences such as James Allen, Henry Drummond, Emmett Fox, William James etc. I think after reading this work we'd have to add Trine to the list Some direct quotes or ideas that may have ended up in the Big Book and pre-date
(1897) James' writing of the VRE (1901-1902). "Higher Power(s)" "Cause and Effect" "Intellectual Pride" "Love and Service" "Just to the degree" (Compare with Just to the extent" "The Great Central Fact" I recommend this book to all and it can be found on line at Project Guttenberg. God Bless John B IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6743. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Father Ed Dowling and Father Ralph Pfau From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/25/2010 6:22:00 PM
gave
in 1957 in an account he gave of how the National Clergy Conference on Alcoholism was created: < . . . it would be a nice thing if we could find out who else among the clergy
are in AA, because I think that priests in AA feel the need to know if there are
other priests in AA," Father Dowling suggested, "Why don't you have a retreat of some kind?">>*
quoting
from Ralph S. Pfau et al., Alcoholism: A Source Book for the Priest: An Anthology (Indianapolis: National Clergy Conference on Alcoholism, Indianapolis, 1960; reprint Lake Orion, Michigan: National Catholic Council on Alcoholism and Related Drug Problems [NCCA], 1998). This was the start of what became the National Clergy Conference on Alcoholism, now called the National Catholic Council on Alcoholism and Related Drug Problems. It was founded by Father Ralph Pfau from Indianapolis, who was the first Roman Catholic priest to get sober in AA, and was one of the four most published AA authors.
and publishes the texts of all the speeches in a volume called the Blue Book.
well known figures. There are talks not only by Bill Wilson, but also Marty Mann, Father Ed Dowling, and many other people. The best place to find copies of this series would be in the library at a Catholic university or seminary. The Indianapolis Archdiocesan Archives has a partial set, but there are also some volumes missing.
of a long discussion by Father Ed Dowling and Father Ralph Pfau on whether and how far Catholics who are alcoholics are morally responsible for their alcoholism -- i.e. to what degree and in what way might alcoholism be regarded as a sin in Catholic moral theology.
at the beginning of an alcoholic's career, the alcoholic may well have been morally responsible for his or her abuse of alcohol. Knowingly and willingly becoming dangerously drunk is a sin in traditional Catholic moral theology (included under the deadly sin of Gluttony, which in Latin means "sins of the gullet" and therefore could involve anything we swallowed or inhaled down our throats). But once it became an irresistible compulsion, the drinking of the alcohol was not itself a sin any longer.
moral theology, an act must be a conscious and willing violation of a known law of God.
was, but I do remember that the discussion was very interesting and very knowledgeable on both sides.
volume of the Blue Book which has the transcript of that debate, and put it online. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6744. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Bill W. and Father Ralph Pfau From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/25/2010 6:28:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Question asked by Mike Margetis "What about Bill W. and Father Pfau? Did they get along? Did they know each other well?" 1958 -- falling out with Bill W. over anonymity: Ralph began a long friendship with Bill Wilson when he and Bill met one another in San Diego in 1948 and then
traveled to Ensenada, Mexico together. The two of them also appeared on the same speakers platform in Austin in June of that same year, and remained lifelong friends, except for this dispute over the anonymity principle which put
them temporarily at odds with one another for a period of time. Ralph had long had his detractors within A.A. Letters in the New York A.A. Archives complained for example, because Ralph would give A.A. groups an up-front charge to speak at conferences and conventions ($75.00 to speak at a meeting in Philadelphia in 1962 for example) and he also asked them to allow him to sell his books at places where he spoke. He did this to cover his travel expenses but also to pay his yearly living expenses. Under his arrangement with
the Archbishop, he received no salary from the Archdiocese of Indianapolis. He may have received room and board free from Sister Austin and the Magdalen nuns at the Convent of the Good Shepherd in Indianapolis in return for acting as their confessor, or he may have had to pay them a nominal amount for that. This
is unclear, but we do know that his overall expenses were in the neighborhood of $600 a year when he first began devoting his full time to his A.A. work. He was
eventually able to purchase a fairly nice automobile towards the end of his life, to use in traveling about giving talks, but continued to live in the three rooms which the convent allowed him to use (using one room as an office during the day and as a place to sleep during the night), in monastic austerity. But the issue that actually caused the break between Ralph and Bill W. was a different one, the anonymity issue. Ralph had headed the National Clergy Conference on Alcoholism openly and under his full name from the time of its founding in 1949. His niece said he felt he could do a lot more good by breaking his anonymity in that fashion, no matter the consequences to his own
priestly career. A priest in A.A.? Ralph wanted people to stop and realize, well why not, and of course! Bill W. did not openly criticize Ralph's role in the NCCA, but finally became
angered by Ralph's breaking of his anonymity in the publication of his autobiography in Look magazine in 1958. It not only gave his full name, but there were also a number photographs showing Ralph's face, portraying him in full ecclesiastical vestments celebrating mass, and so on. In Bill Wilson's letters, he linked this with Lillian Roth's publication of her autobiography, I'll Cry Tomorrow four years earlier, in which she also broke her anonymity and
spoke of her A.A. membership in print in public. Bill W. roundly condemned both
of them to the rest of the A.A. fellowship. It should be said, however, that Bill Wilson himself had been on the road promoting A.A. all across the country during the 1940's, and allowing his photograph to be taken and printed in the local newspapers with great regularity. See for example his full face photo in the August 9, 1942 issue of the Knoxville Journal. Bill had changed his mind by the 1950's, but not everyone in A.A. believed that the newly devised and far stricter rules about
anonymity were wise or good. 1965 -- making peace in Toronto: At the Fourth A.A. International Convention in Toronto in 1965, Ralph and Bill W. restored their friendship. A Canadian Catholic priest, Father Pete W., was present when Ralph and Bill W. met and made
their peace with one another. He told me the story in a long telephone conversation. Pete (who was a relative newcomer to A.A. at that time, and had not become a priest yet) was one of the A.A. people posted on guard duty in the hotel hallway on the floor where Bill W. had his hotel room. His instructions were to let no one disturb Bill, with one exception: if Father Ralph Pfau came up, he was to immediately take him to see Bill. Ralph did in fact come, and went into Bill's hotel room where the two of them talked for a long time, an hour and a half or two. Pete says that it was very clear from the expressions on their faces when Ralph came back out, and from the way the two men said good-by to one another, that they parted the best of friends once again. Both these great A.A. leaders were near the ends of their lives by that point: Ralph died only a year and a half later and Bill passed away on January 24, 1971. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6745. . . . . . . . . . . . Father Ed Dowling and Father Ralph Pfau
From: Michael . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/24/2010 12:29:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hi all, What is known about Father Ed's and Father Ralph's interaction and or friendship? I can't seem to find anything with regards to whether or not they had much to do with each other.
Did they know each other well? Thanks, Mike Margetis Brunswick, MD IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6746. . . . . . . . . . . . Can anyone tell me a little more history about Al S. From: Claus R. Larosse . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/23/2010 11:45:00 AM
history about Al S. Besides what just immediately come forward by searching for Div AA history pages.
knowledge/texts dealing with accountability, spirituality and so on. I found out Al S. is the author of the AA accountability statement. And that Al came to AA in 1944, helped start the intergroup in New York. Al worked with a George B. to get Knickerbocker Hospital to open a section just for alcoholics who were sponsored by AA. But this is basically what I can find. Has Al a story in Big Book, perhaps? Having a "nickname"? Who was his sponsor? Last but not least. Has Al or other written anything about accountability/responsibility in AA besides that I can find in Big Book and 12 + 12 :-)
-- Knus.
Stubdrupvej 211. 7100 Vejle Tlf. 23252344
pp. 39-43 From: martinholmes76@ymail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/25/2010 4:22:00 AM
(Big Book p. 39) that "Fred" was in hospital with "a bad case of jitters." Does anyone know how long he was drinking before this? - - - - From Glenn C., Moderator "Fred" = Harry Brick AA historians believe that "Fred," described as a "partner in a well known accounting firm" in the story in pp. 39-43 of the Big Book, was Harry Brick. See
Harry's story "A Different Slant" in the first edition of the Big Book. - - - - For more information see the material collected by Nancy Olson et al. at http://www.a-1associates.com/westbalto/HISTORY_PAGE/Authors.htm A Different Slant Harry Brick NY 2nd Board Chair Original Manuscript #33, Big Book 1st ed. page 252
the
money he had loaned A.A. to get the Big Book published refunded. Harry was probably an accountant. He is believed to be "Fred, a partner in a well known accounting firm" whose story is told on pages 39 through 43 of the Big Book. He was happily married with fine children, sufficient income to indulge his whims and future financial security. He was known as a conservative, sound businessman. To all appearances he was a stable, well-balanced individual, with
an attractive personality who made friends easily. However, he missed going to his office several times because of drinking, and
when he failed in efforts to stop on his own, had to be hospitalized -- a blow
to his ego. At the hospital a doctor told him about a group of men staying sober, and he reluctantly consented to have one of them call on him, only to be polite to the doctor. He refused help from the man who called on him, but within sixty days, after leaving the hospital the second time, he was pounding at his door, willing to do anything to conquer the vicious thing that had conquered him. He soon learned that not only had his drinking problem been relieved, but quite
as important was the discovery that spiritual principles would solve all his problems. While his old way of living was by no means a bad one, he would not go back to it he would not go back to it even if he could. His worst days in the fellowship were better than his best days when he was drinking. His story is the shortest in the 1st edition. He had only one point he wanted to make. Even a man with everything money can buy, a man with tremendous pride and
will power to function in all ordinary circumstances, could become an alcoholic and find himself as hopeless and helpless as the man who has a multitude of worries and troubles. Doctor Earl M. ("Physician Heal Thyself") described this as "the skid row of success," p. 345, 3rd edition. Harry served on the first board of trustees of the Alcoholic Foundation, replacing Bill Ruddell, who got drunk. Soon Harry was drunk, too. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6748. . . . . . . . . . . . Freemasonry and A.A. From: Dougbert . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/26/2010 9:20:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hi Group, I continue to see the esoteric references to Freemasonry throughout A.A. literature, including the fact that our A.A. logo is directly taken from Scottish Rite symbology.
Freemasons could come together and find the deeper meanings underlying the A.A. philosophy and the root teaching of my beloved craft. For example, the numeral twelve goes back to the twelve tribes of Israel. If there are any Masons out there that would like to take on this project, please contact me. As Masons, we know our proud history is found in the allegory and symbology found in the Hebrew teachings. doug IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6749. . . . . . . . . . . . Was Bill W. actually a stock broker? From: Tom Hickcox . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/26/2010 9:17:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII The Big Book tells us on p. xv of the Fourth Edition that Bill W was a stock broker. In these days one must meet certain licensing requirements in order to be one.
What were the requirements, if any, in Bill's time? Was he licensed? [That means under the requirements as they existed back in the 1920's and 1930's, not under the modern requirements.] So, what are some firm citations for or against Bill's status as a stock broker? Tommy H in Baton Rouge IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6750. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Bill W. and Father Ralph Pfau From: Baileygc23@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 7/26/2010 5:59:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I think this material from Barefoot Bill's site was written by Nancy Olson: While Father Pfau obviously had great affection for Bill Wilson, he apparently did not always agree with him. Four o'clock on Sunday afternoon July 3, 1955, at
the International A.A. Convention in St. Louis, was a watershed moment in the
history of Alcoholics Anonymous. The fifth General Service Conference met during
the Convention. This marked the end of the five-year trial period for the Conference. Bill Wilson had campaigned for the Conference vigorously. But Father Pfau, who was influential, though controversial, had announced he was going to rise and speak against it. When Bill presented his resolution and a vote of approval was requested, reported Nell Wing, "We from the office sat with baited breath." But Father Pfau did not object and the resolution passed. Tex Brown, who died October 5, 2000, told me this story at the International Convention in Minneapolis a few months before his death. I asked him to write it for the AA History Buffs. Tex attended the first International A.A. Convention in Cleveland in 1950. He told me "At the 'Spiritual Meeting' on Sunday morning the main speaker's topic dealt with the idea that the alcoholic was to be the instrument that God would use to regenerate and save the world. He expounded the idea that alcoholics were God's Chosen People and he was starting to talk
about AA being 'The Third Covenant,' when he was interrupted by shouted objections from the back of the room. The objector, who turned out to be a small Catholic priest, would not be hushed up. There was chaos and embarrassment as the meeting was quickly adjourned. I was upset and in full sympathy with the poor speaker. I did not realize it at the time, but I had seen Father Pfau in action and Father Pfau was right. I had heard the group conscience and I rejected it."
spiritual side of Alcoholics Anonymous -- as they understood it. ... A hush fell upon the crowd as we paused for a moment of silence. Then came the speakers, earnest and carefully prepared, all of them. I cannot recall an A.A. gathering where the attention was more complete, or the devotion deeper.
enthusiasm, unintentionally created a bit of a problem. It was felt the meeting had gone Yüklə 25,47 Mb. Dostları ilə paylaş:
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