Aa history Lovers 2009 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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(hartsell at etex.net) from Gilmer, Texas (a small town in east Texas, pop. 4,799). He is 74 years old, and has been sober since since December 29, 1967.
I sobered up." - - - - From: "Ben Humphreys" (blhump272 at sctv.coop) I can remember when I first came to AA in the middle 70s we all sat at the table for the whole meeting. It was in the later 70s that we started holding hands and saying the Lord's Prayer .... I can still see (in my mind) some of the oldtimers standing with their arms folded in ... protest.
From: nuevenueve@ymail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/12/2009 4:20:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII What did the "S" stand for in Ralph S. Pfau? What was his middle name? (The man who was the Father John Doe of the Golden Books) Thank you. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6056. . . . . . . . . . . . Groups named after Fr. Pfau From: nuevenueve@ymail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/12/2009 4:20:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Were or are there any AA groups named "Fr. Pfau" or "Fr. John Doe" appearing in AA Directories, anywhere in the world?
to name AA groups after individual AA members, living or dead. But this has never been totally enforceable, and -- to give just one example -- it was in fact the case that for many years, the Saturday Evening Group in Indianapolis, Indiana, was called the Meyerson Group, in honor of Irwin Meyerson, who made the twelfth step call on Doherty Sheerin, the founder of AA in Indianapolis. See: http://hindsfoot.org/nindy2.html See also: http://hindsfoot.org/nIndy1.html http://hindsfoot.org/Nhome.html And similar things have happened in other parts of the world. So what Juan is asking is, NOT whether this is present New York GSO recommended policy, but whether it ever did in fact happen.
From: glennccc . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/14/2009 5:14:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Birth and early years: Ralph Sylvester Pfau was born on November 10, 1904 in Indianapolis, Indiana, to Charles Pfau and Elizabeth Smith Pfau (his father was of French background and his mother of German background). He was baptized on December 4 in the old Holy Cross Church in that city, which was a rather modest brick structure, for the parish had only been founded nine years earlier by Irish immigrants (the present large stone church was not built until 1922, when
Ralph was eighteen). Ralph's father, who made his living doing sales with a horse and buggy, was a heavy drinker, almost certainly an alcoholic. He died when Ralph was only four, probably as a consequence of his drinking. But he left his family with a building on North Rural Street in Indianapolis, with a place for them to live
upstairs and a downstairs that could be rented out for commercial purposes, so Ralph's mother was able to stay home and spend her full time taking care of her children. Ralph was the youngest of the six (all of them boys). Ralph's brother Jerome ("Jerry"), who was six years older, seems to have acted as a father figure (and sometimes deeply frustrated would-be caretaker) to him on numerous
occasions through the years, even after they were both adults. There was a strong tradition in the family of service to the church. Ralph's Uncle George was a priest and his Uncle Al in particular was the sixth Bishop of Nashville, Tennessee. This was the Most Rev. Alphonse John Smith (November 14, 1883-December 16, 1935), who during his early career established the parish of St. Joan of Arc in Indianapolis (where Ralph was appointed as an assistant pastor in 1943 when he finally hit bottom and telephoned A.A.). When he became
bishop of Nashville in 1924 (the year Ralph turned twenty), he found that there
were only a few priests in his diocese who actually came from Tennessee, and only ten Tennessee seminarians preparing to enter the priesthood. Within two years he had recruited sixty young Tennesseans to enter seminary, and was busy
building churches and schools all over Tennessee. The family (and particularly Ralph's mother) had decided when Ralph and his brother Jerry were little boys that the two of them were also going to become priests, and continue the family tradition of clerical greatness. Jerry, who was six years older, was ordained around 1923, when Ralph was eighteen; he was then sent to Rome to earn a Doctorate of Sacred Theology, and was already back in Indiana, teaching at Saint Mary-of-the-Woods College near Terre Haute, when Ralph was ordained deacon on May 29, 1928. This was the nation's oldest Catholic liberal arts college for women, founded by Mother Théodore Guérin,
Indiana's first saint. It was a quite distinguished place to be teaching for a Catholic academic at that point in history, and in particular, it was firmly linked into the ruling circles within the Archdiocese of Indianapolis. But one can see the problem which this represented for the young Ralph. In most
Catholic families of that period, having a son in the priesthood was in and of itself an accomplishment of enormous note, even if he never rose beyond the parish ministry. But in Ralph's family, one was expected to be not only a capable priest, but also a great scholar or administrator, who could earn yet further renown for the family. There was an additional difficulty here. Jerry was an alcoholic just like Ralph.
But Jerry managed to last quite a few years longer than Ralph as what is sometimes called a "functioning alcoholic," meaning that he did not lose his job because of it, or get arrested for drunken driving, or encounter any other kind of major public difficulties because of his compulsive drinking. In addition, Jerry had Ralph convinced for many years that one was not an alcoholic as long as one did not drink before noon. So Ralph would use drugs (barbiturates and sedatives) to endure painfully through the mornings, keeping his eye on the clock at all times, and would force himself to wait until noon (on the minute) before throwing down his first desperate drink of the day. Jerry however did not escape the consequences of his drinking forever. He ended
up a tragic figure, finally dying in June 1957 when he was around 59 years old,
because of problems which were at least partially brought on by his alcoholism. He was hospitalized in Louisville and still trying to bribe the nurses to bring
him a bottle as he lay there dying. Putting all of these piece together, we can see how Ralph, during his childhood and adolescence, was put under a great deal of psychological pressure by his family background. Furthermore, as not only the youngest child (the baby of the family), but also as the boy "who was going to become a priest," young Ralph was given enormous privilege. According to what his brothers said later on, he was totally spoiled. At breakfast time, if an egg yolk was broken, his mother would cook him another egg. That sort of treatment created in him a sense of entitlement where -- even after he was an adult, and even though he knew better
intellectually -- a part of him down at the subconscious level believed that people around him were supposed automatically to give him whatever he asked for.
behave
like a little plaster saint instead of like a normal small boy, and to end up at
the top in every sphere of activity into which he entered. As Ralph's niece commented, many years later, "Uncle Ralph felt like he never came up to [his mother's] expectations," no matter what he accomplished.
High
School in Indianapolis and began studying for the priesthood at the seminary at St. Meinrad Archabbey down in the hills along the Ohio river. Indiana was still a largely rural state at that time: young Ralph was able to make most of the journey by local trains, but the last stage was by horse and buggy -- a one-horse shay with a fringe on top -- down crude dirt roads. The abbey church at St. Meinrad was set on top of a hill, surrounded by green woods and rolling fields. The Benedictine monks who lived in the abbey also ran the seminary. The boys slept in a sixty-bed dormitory, where each boy was given a bed, a chair, and a row of hangers on the wall. The outside toilets were sixty yards away. Scrupulosity and perfectionism: Ralph got through his first six years at St. Meinrad with no notable problems, but then fell into a long period of debilitating psychological turmoil which continued with greater and lesser degrees of severity from the Spring of 1928 to the Spring of 1929. The onset came when he was scheduled to be ordained deacon on May 29, 1928. Young Ralph,
now twenty-three, could not eat. He could not sleep, he could not think straight, and torrents of thoughts circled around and around in his mind as he grew ever more frantic. His obsessive perfectionism was so great that he did not feel morally "worthy" to be a priest. The two advisors whom he went to both said the same thing. First Fr. Anselm told
him, "This is just a matter of scruples." Then he went to talk about his fears
with Monsignor Joseph E. Hamill, the Chancellor of the diocese, who likewise told him, "This is just scruples." Ralph made himself go through the ordination service, but afterwards, he said,
"I was so depressed I wished I were dead." The summer which followed was a nightmare. Doctors in Indianapolis finally put him on barbiturates and powerful bromide compounds. When he returned to St. Meinrad in the fall for his final year of seminary, he once again was unable to eat or sleep, and by the middle of October was in the depths of total depression. He tried all the traditional methods of prayer and meditation, including all of the recommended Catholic spiritual literature of his era, such as Louis Blosius's Comfort of the Faint-Hearted, but none of this seemed to help much. Fervent prayers to the Blessed Virgin Mary finally seemed to lift him out of the worst of his distress, but then the night before his ordination to the priesthood, he came down with a 104 degree temperature and had
a complete physical collapse. The next day, May 21, 1929, he was ordained priest
while sitting on a chair instead of standing and kneeling through the course of the service like the other ordinands. As was noted, the priests whom he had consulted had all diagnosed Ralph's problem as one of scrupulosity, using the old traditional technical term from Catholic moral theology. A scrupulus in Latin was a small pebble, and hence by extension, could be used to refer to worries over tiny things, anxiety over something small which nevertheless nagged continuously like a pebble in one's
shoe. In the modern English metaphor, it was a pathological compulsion to turn
molehills into mountains. ______________________________ Taken from Glenn F. Chesnut, "Fr. Ralph Pfau," which is to be Chapter 4 in the forthcoming book: "Recovery Through Catholic Eyes: Important Catholic Figures in the History of the Recovery Movement: Essays in Honor of Ernest Kurtz," edited by Oliver J. Morgan, Ph.D., Professor and Chair, Department of Counseling and Human Services, University of Scranton. To be published by Guest House Institute and Sacred Heart University Press. - - - - Additional note: Some of Ralph Pfau's records are at the Archdiocesan Archives in Indianapolis. His grade reports from St. Meinrad's are in Latin (this was the old days). They Latinized "Ralph" on his records as "Raphael" (after the Archangel).
wrote:
> > What did the "S" stand for in Ralph S. Pfau? > What was his middle name? > > (The man who was the Father John Doe of the > Golden Books) > > Thank you. > IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6058. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Groups named after Fr. Pfau From: MarionORedstone@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/13/2009 9:57:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Glenn, Indianapolis continues to rebel. We do have a Pfau group that is still meeting. Marion - - - - From: dctim (dctim322 at yahoo.com) Is there a traditional prohibition on naming groups after persons? - - - - SEE NEXT MESSAGE, FROM ARTHUR SHEEHAN - - - - IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6059. . . . . . . . . . . . RE: Groups named after Fr. Pfau From: Arthur S . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/14/2009 12:50:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII We might consider having a history discussion on the General Service Structure to understand what GSO does and doesn't do. GSO does not make or recommend policy nor do they attempt to "enforce" any (copyrights notwithstanding). They are an administrative office within AA World Services (AAWS). Policy matters are a function of the General Service Board, the boards of AAWS and Grapevine and the Conference. Anonymity is not a matter of policy - it is a matter of principle (the spiritual foundation of all our Traditions). The New Group Information form, for group registration, states "A.A.'s Traditions suggest that a group not be named after a facility or member (living or deceased), and that the name of a group not imply affiliation with any sect, religion, organization or institution." The preceding does not derive from GSO, it derives from AA's Traditions. The New Group Information form is also contained in the AA Service Manual which is Conference-approved literature.
they should do whatever they elect to do is a matter of separate discussion. I believe the substance and tone of what might make good anonymity practice for groups and members can be found in Bill W's commentary in AA Comes of Age on pgs 136-137: "A year after his passing, I visited the Akron cemetery where Dr. Bob and Anne lie. The simple stone says not a word about Alcoholics Anonymous. Some people may think that this wonderful couple carried personal anonymity too far when they so firmly refused to use the words "Alcoholics Anonymous" even on their own burial stone. For one, I do not think so. I think that this moving and final example of self-effacement will prove of more permanent worth to AA than any amount of public attention or any great monument." The General service Board and Conference has recommended the following by policy and advisory action: 1960 General Service Board approved the policy statement: "The Board believes that AA members generally think it unwise to break the anonymity of a member even after his death, but that in each situation the final decision must rest the family. A few states are particularly stringent with respect to the problem, interpreting such anonymity breaks as a breach of privacy subject to legal action. 1968 General Service Conference Advisory Action: recommended that the showing of the full face of an AA member at the level of press, TV and films be considered a violation of the Anonymity Tradition, even though the name is withheld. That the Board adopt the following policy statement to be used in answering inquiries relating to posthumous breaking of anonymity: The board generally believes that AA members think it unwise to break the anonymity of a member even after his death, but that in each situation the final decision must rest with the family. 1988 General Service Conference Advisory Action: It was recommended that the 1971 General Service Conference Action be reaffirmed: "A.A. members generally think it unwise to break the anonymity of a member even after his death, but in each situation the final decision must rest with the family." Further, the A.A. Archives continue to protect the anonymity of deceased A.A. members as well as other members. 1993 General Service Conference Advisory Action: each area delegate encourage discussions within all AA groups on the spiritual principles of Anonymity, including photographs, publications and posthumous anonymity, as related to our Eleventh and Twelfth Traditions. 2007 General Service Conference Advisory Action: A section on posthumous anonymity be developed by the Publications Department for inclusion in the pamphlet "Understanding Anonymity" and a draft be brought back to the 2008 Conference Committee on Public Information for consideration. The "Understanding Anonymity" pamphlet (which is Conference-approved literature states the following: Q. I maintain an Internet Web site and also belong to an online meeting. At what level should I protect my anonymity on the internet? A. Publicly accessible aspects of the Internet such as Web sites featuring text, graphics, audio and video ought to be considered another form of "public media." Thus, they need to be treated in the same manner as press, radio, TV and films. This means that full names and faces should not be used. However, the level of anonymity in email, online meetings and chat rooms would be a personal decision.
Arthur
++++Message 6060. . . . . . . . . . . . Nan Robertson dies, author of Getting Better: Inside A.A. From: aadavidi . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/14/2009 5:46:00 PM
"Getting Better: Inside Alcoholics Anonymous." http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5jrt2hfWnR3TOfcR2BUHUoaiXsV SgD9\
Nan Robertson, a Pulitzer Prize-winning New York Times reporter who wrote a book
about female employees' fight for equal treatment at the newspaper, has died.
She was 83. Robertson died Tuesday of heart disease at a nursing home in Rockville, said Jane Freundel Levey, her stepdaughter-in-law. The veteran reporter won a 1983 Pulitzer Prize for feature writing for a personal piece — an unsparing account of her sudden encounter with toxic shock syndrome. The article, published in The New York Times Magazine, detailed how the illness led to the amputation of the end joints of all her fingers except for her thumbs. Robertson began working for the Times in 1955, when women were frequently assigned to write about topics such as fashion, shopping and interior decorating. Over more than three decades with the newspaper, she was promoted to the metropolitan staff and then to the Washington bureau, where she covered the
first lady and the first family, and then to the paper's bureau in Paris ....
correspondent there, Robertson returned to New York to seek treatment for alcoholism, a battle she wrote about in her 1988 book, "Getting Better: Inside Alcoholics Anonymous." IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6061. . . . . . . . . . . . What sedative was Bill taking in Big Book page 7 From: Ben Hammond . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/17/2009 6:10:00 PM
Bill W. on p. 7 of the Big Book? "next day found me drinking both gin and sedative" Thanks and God Bless, Ben H, Tulsa Oklahoma - - - - From the moderator: When AA authors from the 1930's and 40's talk about taking sedatives, in the texts from that period which I have read, and they tell what specifically they are taking, it is always either barbiturates or bromide compounds that they mention. That's in the things that I have read.
"was commonly used to induce sleep in sufferers from delirium tremens" but is no longer used in detoxing alcoholics today. And I don't remember ever reading about alcoholics taking paraldehyde other than when they were being detoxed, so I don't think Bill W. was drinking paraldehyde to calm himself down in the story on page 7.
of other substances which might have been prescribed by a physician in the 1930's which also might have been described as a "sedative"?
spirituality vs. religion From: Rich Foss . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/20/2009 9:33:00 AM
prayer in the 24 hour book is a Sanskrit proverb. Does that suggest that it is a translation of a Hindu prayer? - - - - From the moderator -- that passage reads: Look to this day, For it is life, The very life of life. In its brief course lie all The realities and verities of existence, The bliss of growth, The splendor of action, The glory of power -- For yesterday is but a dream, And tomorrow is only a vision, But today, well lived, Makes every yesterday a dream of happiness And every tomorrow a vision of hope.
by Kalidasa, Indian poet and playwright, fourth century A.D. - - - - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/K%C4%81lid%C4%81sa Kalidasa [his name means "servant of the goddess Kali"] was a renowned Classical Sanskrit writer, widely regarded as the greatest poet and dramatist in the Sanskrit language. His floruit cannot be dated with precision, but most likely falls within the Gupta period, probably in the 4th or 5th century or 6th century. His place in Sanskrit literature is akin to that of Shakespeare in English. His plays and poetry are primarily based on Hindu mythology and philosophy.
on the figure of the great Hindu goddess Kali. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6063. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: What sedative was Bill taking in Big Book page 7 From: buckjohnson41686 . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/20/2009 3:54:00 AM
1930's 'barbs'would have been in common use with a variety available.
(A liquid.) I doubt Bill was using chloral hydrate.
liquid, primarily used to detox alcoholics. Possibly morphine or some other opiate. Beside bromides this could also be any combination that a physician might prescribe, most drugs were compounded by pharmacists; so it could also include belladonna alkaloids, or opiates. Belladonna-opium combinations and Belladonna/phenobarb (or other barb) were commonly used for almost any abdominal/gut symptoms. I recall seeing an AA VHS tape where Bill says that prior to Dr Bob going to the hospital to do surgery, "I gave him a beer and a goofball"
(elg3_79 at yahoo.com) It could have been chloral hydrate that was being used as the prescription for Bill. Details at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloral_hydrate A solution of chloral hydrate is referred to as "knockout drops" when it is secretly added to an alcoholic beverage to produce a "Mickey Finn," which is given to the victim in order to produce unconsciousness.
years ... that could have been a possibility. - - - - From: "Ben Humphreys" (blhump272 at sctv.coop) I can remember when paraldehyde was used in hospital detoxification. It would go right through the bottom of a styrofoam cup. Just ate it up so it was given in a plastic cup. I remember watching a sponsee taking his medicine and he said, "It tastes bad but doesn't make you highiiiii ...." Took the starch right out of him! Lord it smelled bad. That was in the late 70's. Ben H., Gate City, Virginia IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 6064. . . . . . . . . . . . The Great Reality in the Big Book pp. 55 and 161 From: Bernadette MacLeod . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/19/2009 2:17:00 PM
pp. 55 and 161 of the Big Book refer to, and what is its origin?
King City Group Ontario, Canada
Big Book page 7 From: Shakey1aa@aol.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 10/18/2009 7:43:00 PM
should all be aware that the biggest sedative prescribed by physicians was Ethyl Alcohol. The following can explain to the layman some of the history of alcohol as a sedative and the rise of short acting, medium acting, and long acting sedative hypnotics.
Shakey Mike Gwirtz Going to Macon, Georgia next year for the 14th NAW (National Archives Workshop). Hope to see you there.
by Edward M. Brecher and the Editors of Consumer Reports Magazine, 1972
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