Aa history Lovers 2009 moderators Nancy Olson and Glenn F. Chesnut page
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I find it very handy. Tommy H in Baton Rouge - - - - At 13:35 4/23/2009, diazeztone wrote: >A lady wrote me from my website wanting a June 1940 Grapevine. > >Does anybody know where to obtain well-done reproductions?? > >I include her message here: > >Greetings from another AA in Kentucky .... You came up on >Google. I'm looking for a 1949 Grapevine, June if possible, for yet >another AA who is turning 60 this June, born in 1949. Please let me >know if you have/know of any .... Thanks! > >Suzanne Warden >suzanne.warden at gmail > >ld pierce >aabibliography.com >eztone at hotmail IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5656. . . . . . . . . . . . Father Ralph Pfau From: nuevenueve@ymail.com . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/27/2009 2:17:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Hi, good day and 24 happy sobriety hours to all AA members, good day to non-AA members: Dears, I´ve been searching what were the causes Fr. Pfau´s literature was not approved or included by the conference. Were there religion causes? Did Father Pfau relapse and that´s why?
available? From: James Blair . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/27/2009 2:23:00 PM
issue. They can be purchased on their web site. Jim IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5658. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Father Ralph Pfau From: bsdds@comcast.net . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/27/2009 4:05:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII This is the sticky wicket (IMO) of "approved literature." It has nothing to do with content but where it is published and how distributed. Just like a great amt of literature isn't "approved" out of Hazelden . Yet there is the Little Red Book and 24 Hours a Day book. They are not approved. So widely used was the Little Red Book, that Dr. Bob used it to explain the the steps (before the 12/12) along with the Detroit Papers. There is a great source on the Hindsfoot under the site on the four original authors in AA, Bill being just one. A.A. Historical Materials Part 1
http://hindsfoot.org/archives.html - - - - "Approved Literature" is the source of revenue for AA and they go to great lengths to explain that other literature is not "outlawed." There are some areas tho, that use the term "approved literature" like any thing else is written by the evil sister of Cinderella. respectfully submitted
From: nuevenueve @ ymail .com To: AAHistoryLovers @ yahoogroups .com Sent: Monday, April 27, 2009 2:17:28 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [ AAHistoryLovers ] Father Ralph Pfau
all AA members, good day to non-AA members: Dears, I´ ve been searching what were the causes Fr. Pfau ´s literature was not approved or included by the conference. Were there religion causes? Did Father Pfau relapse and that´s why?
From: Joseph Nugent . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/27/2009 6:02:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII AA Conference approves only what it prints. They say the 3 most prolific writers were Richmond Walker (24 hours a day) Fr. Ralph Pfau (John Doe Golden Books) and Bill Wilson. Fr. Ralph didn't have a slip/relapse. Others may give you more/better information, Joe - - - - From: Tom White (tomwhite at cableone.net) Dear Hugo: I am moved to write at once before my own notions are contradicted by others who may write. It is my impression that Fr. Pfau's work has simply joined the other (and hugely more voluminous) writings that were so important in AA's earlier years, in coming under the AA Conference rubric: "not Conference-approved literature."
early teachings), the 24-hour prayer book, and, indeed, even the Bible. My understanding is that this does not mean such writings are disapproved or unacceptable in any sense. It simply means, if I may put it this way, that they were not published by AA itself. By which I mean the publishing concern which AA World Services operates. I think AA HQ has tried at least somewhat to stem the trend toward negative branding of everything it does NOT publish, but I am not sure how successful it has been. Very best to you. Tom W, Odessa, Texas IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5660. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Father Ralph Pfau From: allan_gengler . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/27/2009 5:10:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII There's no such thing as an "approved" aa reading list, though it is often misrepresented by members of AA. There are two AA publishing companies, one being the grapevine. For AA proper all literature and pamphlets must go through
the appropriate committee, submitted to the general conference and get approval. The Big Book can't be changed without at least a 2/3 vote.
"Conference-approved" — What It Means to You The term has no relation to material not published by G.S.O. It does not imply
Conference disapproval of other material about A.A. A great deal of literature helpful to alcoholics is published by others, and A.A. does not try to tell any
individual member what he or she may or may not read. BUT From the AA Guidelines from the Literature Committee: The spirit of the 1977 Conference action regarding group litera- ture displays be reaffirmed, and recommended the suggestion that A.A. groups be encouraged to display or sell only literature published and distributed by the General Service Office, the A.A. Grapevine and other A.A. entities.
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/AAHistoryLovers/message/4798 History of the term Conference Approved The 1952 Conference Literature Committee reaffirmed the stand taken by the 1951 Conference as follows: "This conference has no desire to review, edit, or censor non-Foundation material. Our object is to provide, in the future, a means of distinguishing Foundation literature from that issued locally or by non-AA interests." - - - - Service Material From G.S.O. "Conference-approved -- What It Means" "The term 'Conference-approved' describes written or audiovisual material approved by the Conference for publication by G.S.O. This process assures that everything in such literature is in accord with A.A. principles. Conference-approved material always deals with the recovery program of Alcoholics Anonymous or with information about the A.A. Fellowship." "The term has no relation to material not published by G.S.O. It does not imply Conference disapproval of other material about A.A. A great deal of literature helpful to alcoholics is published by others, and A.A. does not try to tell any individual member what he or she may or may not read."
even which are not conference-approved, such as pamphlets and booklets printed under the sponsorship of a local AA group or intergroup:
distribute pamphlets or booklets that are not Conference-approved. If such pieces meet the needs of the local membership, they may be legitimately classified as 'A.A. literature.' There is no conflict between A.A. World Services, Inc. (A.A.W.S. -- publishers of Conference-approved literature), and central offices or intergroups -- rather they complement each other. The Conference does not disapprove of such material."
at one point (1972), that when a group or intergroup or AA conference puts literature out for sale, that they put the conference approved material in one location, and the non conference approved material on another table or bookshelf or part of the table. But that was just a recommendation, where AA groups are autonomous and can set their own guidelines however they wish. IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5661. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Book signed by Dr Bob and Bill W From: schaberg43 . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/28/2009 1:07:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII I own a first edition, first printing (1939) of the Big Book that was signed by both Bill and Bob (and also, Jim Burwell). Although there is no date on Bob's inscription (signed "Dr. Bob Smith"), I was told that this comment and signature were done by Dr. Bob after the 1950 Cleveland Convention and just six weeks before Bob died on November 16, 1950. Bill's inscription is also signed in full
("Bill Wilson") and is dated - in Bill's typical fashion - 5/24/51 in Oklahoma
City. (There is no date or place noted by Jim in his inscription.) Also in my collection is an 11th printing of the first edition (1947) with signatures by Bill Wilson (full name), Lois Wilson (ditto) and "Ann & Dr. Bob Smith." Bill has also signed the half-title page that follows "Bill Wilson." The brief inscription and the four (three?) signatures seem to be done in a very 'sloppy' and hurried manner - unlike most other signatures that I have seen, but
they are genuine nonetheless. It's just that these particular signatures have
something of an "on the run" feel to them. For the record, Bill signed literally thousands of books over the years. Bob was
not only around much less time than Bill, he was also more of a 'homebody' compared to Bill and a much humbler, gentler soul than Bill. Inscribed copies by Dr. Bob are therefore considerably scarcer and what could easily be called "rare" compared to those left by Bill.
in the same place at the same time to end up with side-by-side inscriptions in a book. AA's were (and are) notoriously persistent when they want to accomplish something and - as is the case with my dual-inscribed 1st, 1st - not hindered by time and distance. I'm sure that is not the only instance where someone had a copy signed by just one of the co-founders and traveled to see the other one for the expressed purpose of obtaining their signature. Over and above that, Bill and Bob frequently visited each other in either New
York or Ohio throughout the early years of AA - although I do not know of anyone
who has taken the time and trouble to document these face-to-face meetings. (Now... there's a nice project for someone!) Best, Old Bill --- In AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com, kentedavis@... wrote: > > I have heard of a 12th printing of the first > edition that was signed by both Dr Bob (his > whole name) and Bill Wilson (his whole name). > I was wondering if it was a one of a kind. > There were not that many times that Bill and > Bob were together with a book to sign, > especially signing their whole names. > > Could this have been signed at the 1950 > International Convention in 1950? This book > was also signed by Lois and Father Pfau. > > Were there other times that Bill and Bob were > together that they might have signed a book? > Does anyone know of other occasions that when > Bill and Bob were together after the book was > published in 1939, other than the International > Convention in 1950? > > Has anyone seen other books that were signed > by both Bill and Bob? > > Kent D. 8/8/88 > IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII ++++Message 5662. . . . . . . . . . . . Re: Father Ralph Pfau From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 4/28/2009 5:21:00 PM IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII Dear Hugo, To answer the actual questions you asked. Father Pfau never had any relapses. He died sober with 23 years of sobriety in 1967. Although he was Roman Catholic, his message spoke to all AA's. At least 60% of the AA's who came to his spiritual retreats were Protestants. There is nothing contrary to good AA teaching in the Golden Books. In fact they
are one of the best things you could read if you wanted to know more about how
to live good AA spirituality in your everyday life. It is good oldtime AA at its
best. So why aren't Father Ralph Pfau's Golden Books "conference approved"? The reason is, simply, that the only books that are "conference approved" are
books where the New York AA office pays for printing them and then gets the royalties from their sales. Richmond Walker offered Twenty Four Hours a Day (the second best selling AA book
of all time) to the New York AA people back in the 1950's and they turned him
down. Ed Webster offered The Little Red Book to them, and they turned him down
too. The only books the New York AA office were publishing back then were books written by Bill W. All the other books written by other AA authors had to be self-published back in
those days. The New York AA office would not lift a finger to help them get their books published. Richmond Walker originally printed his books at the county courthouse and distributed them himself from his home. Ed Webster and his friend Barry Collins called themselves the "Coll-Webb" publishing company, and printed and distributed the Little Red Books themselves. Father Ralph (and one of his nieces
and the three nuns who assisted him at the Convent of the Good Shepherd) likewise printed and distributed the Golden Books themselves (they called themselves "the Society of Matt Talbot Guild").
author could get an AA book published was to self-publish. Glenn C. (South Bend, Indiana) - - - - Message #5656 from Hi, good day and 24 happy sobriety hours to all AA members, good day to non-AA members: Dears, I've been searching what were the causes Fr. Pfau's literature was not approved or included by the conference. Were there religion causes? Did Father Pfau relapse and that's why?
by Bill W. From: Glenn Chesnut . . . . . . . . . . . . 5/3/2009 11:04:00 PM
raised the question, what were the first conference published books which were NOT written by Bill W?
were printed by AAWS prior to Bill W's death, which were written by anyone other than him.
oversight. My preliminary list of non-Bill W. books would include:
**Living Sober (New York: AAWS, 1975, 1998). **Dr. Bob and the Good Oldtimers (New York: AAWS, 1980). **Pass It On: The Story of Bill Wilson (New York: AAWS, 1984). **Daily Reflections (New York: AAWS, 1990).
the first two books on that list: ******************** Came to Believe (New York: AAWS, 1973). ******************** Message #2884: Excerpt from unpublished manuscript on AA History by Bob P., 1985. "Came to Believe," published in 1973, is a collection of stories by A.A. members who tell in their own words what the phrase "spiritual awakening" means to them. Five years previously, an A.A. member had pointed out the need, because many newcomers translate the word "spiritual" in A.A. as meaning "religious." The aim was to show the diversity of convictions implied in "God as we understood Him,".. With which Bill was in delighted agreement. Except for six pieces from the Grapevine the remainder of the contributions were written especially for the book in response to an appeal by G.S.O. and represent the broadest possible sampling of members from all parts of the U.S. and Canada and around the world. The first cover of "Came to Believe" was a photograph of a tender shoot in spring, peeping up through the snow..beautifully symbolic, but perhaps too subtle for the browser at the literature table. It was replaced by a simple dark blue title on an all white background, still low-key and unobtrusive. After 1985, it was given a bright red cover with gold stamping. ******************** Living Sober (New York: AAWS, 1975, 1998). ******************** Message #5162 Barry L.'s claim for royalties for Living Sober
Barry L. and the General Service Board that were in Dr. Bob's collection at Brown University. There is a letter from Barry to George Dorsey on March 7, 1982 (Cc: Robert Pearson). There is a reply to Barry from John Bragg on May 25, 1982 (Cc: Robert Pearson). Finally, there is a letter from Barry to Gordon Patrick, dated February 14, 1983. - - - - The first letter outline Barry's claim to royalties from the sale of Living Sober. The second letter basically says "you negotiated a deal for $4,000 in 1974 and you're not getting any more." The last letter concludes with Barry stating that he is left with no choice but to file a claim for $153,304.45 in retroactive royalties. Chris - - - -
From: Mel B. Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2008 To: AAHistoryLovers@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: Barry L. and Bill W's copy of the Big Book manuscript Hi Rick,
I was pleased to read this additional information about Barry L., the manuscript, etc. If his heirs made a bundle out of the manuscript, it is probably poetic justice. I think Barry did feel he deserved more pay for what services he had rendered to AA World Services and Lois supported him in this effort. It failed, however, and Barry died without getting any additional bucks (at least to my knowledge). He was virtually a son to Lois and accompanied her or her trips. I took a photo of her greeting Jack Bailey in Akron in 1978, with Barry standing behind her. This is the only photo I have of Barry, and I wish another was available. Mel - - - -
Message #3155 Hi All,
I interviewed Barry L. by telephone and obtained the story about the homosexual black man who had contacted Barry about coming into AA. This is how it became included in "Pass It On." I think this happened in 1945. I don't recall any mention of how the man fared after being introduced to the fellowship. I had met Barry at G.S.O. in New York and considered him a good friend. We never discussed his being gay, but I do recall expressing condolences when his partner died. I also attended Marty Mann's memorial services at St. Bartholomew's Episcopal Church in New York City with Barry and a lesbian member who knew Marty. The service was conducted by the minister of the church and Yvelin G., who was an ordained Episcopal minister along with being Marty's close associate for many years at the National Council on Alcoholism. This service was about two months after Marty's passing. I had interviewed Marty earlier that year at her home in Easton, CT, where she also introduced me to her longtime partner, Priscilla Peck. Priscilla was then suffering from Alzheimer's but Marty was still taking care of her, and I had the feeling that they were a very devoted couple. I learned more about their relationship in the Browns' book and was also happy to hear that Priscilla was well taken care of after Marty died. It appeared to me that Lois W.'s best friends in the fellowship were Barry and Nell Wing (though Nell wasn't an alcoholic). Barry accompanied Lois on out-of-town speaking engagements and was otherwise very attentive to her. I believed that Barry was probably in her will, as was Nell, but he predeceased Lois. I was also familiar with Barry's efforts to obtain extra compensation for his work on "Living Sober." Lois reportedly endorsed this effort. I didn't feel he had any grounds for receiving additional pay, as he had taken on the project on a work-for-hire basis with no royalties specified. He used Bill W.'s royalties as a precedent, but I'm sure Bill negotiated the royalty agreement up front when he wrote "The Twelve and Twelve" plus "AA Comes of Age." His Big Book royalties were agreed upon earlier. I think Barry died before this matter was finally settled. Mel Barger Yüklə 11,49 Mb. Dostları ilə paylaş:
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